Part 4 (1/2)
”There is no regular clothing allowed?”
”It appears to me that there is none of any kind.”
”Have you never had prisoners there who have suffered materially for want of clothing?”
”I could describe such scenes as I should hardly think it delicate to mention. We had a woman the other day, on the point of lying-in, brought to bed not many hours after she came in. She had hardly a covering; no stockings, and only a thin gown. Whilst we are there, we can never see a woman in that state without immediately applying to our fund.”
”When they come in they come naked, almost?”
”Yes, this woman came in, and we had to send her up almost every article of clothing, and to clothe her baby. She could not be tried the next sessions, but after she had been tried, and when she was discharged, she went out comfortably clothed; and there are many such instances.”
”Has it not happened that when gentlemen have come in to see the prison, you have been obliged to stand before the women who were in the prison in a condition not fit to be seen?”
”Yes, I remember one instance in which I was obliged to stand before one of the women to prevent her being seen. We sent down to the matron immediately to get her clothes.”
”How long had the woman been in jail?”
”Not long; for we do not, since we have been there, suffer them to be a day without being clothed?”
”What is the average s.p.a.ce allowed to each woman to lie upon, taking the average number in the prison?”
”I cannot be accurate, not having measured; from eighteen inches to two feet, I should think.”
”By six feet?”
”Yes. I believe the moral discipline of a prison can never be complete while they are allowed to sleep together in one room. If I may be allowed to state it, I should prefer a prison where women were allowed to work together in companies, under proper superintendence; to have their meals together, and their recreation also; but I would always have them separated in the night. I believe it would conduce to the health both of body and mind. Their being in companies during the day, tends, under proper regulations, to the advancement of principle and industry, for it affords a stimulus. I should think solitary confinement proper only in atrocious cases. I would divide every woman for a few weeks, until I knew what they were, but I would afterwards regulate them as I have before mentioned.”
”Has gaming entirely ceased?”
”It has of late: they have once been found gaming since we had care of the prison, but I called the women up when I found that some of them had been playing at cards, and represented to them how much I objected to it, and how evil I thought its consequence was, especially to them; at the same time I stated that if there were cards in the prison, I should consider it a proof of their regard if they would have the candor and the kindness to bring me their packs. I did not expect they would do it, for they would feel they had betrayed themselves by it; however, I was sitting with the matron, and heard a gentle tap at the door, and in came a trembling woman to tell me she had brought her pack of cards, that she was not aware how wrong it was, and hoped I would do what I liked with them. In a few minutes another came up, and in this way I had five packs of cards burnt. I a.s.sured them that so far from its being remembered against them, I should remember them in another way. I brought them a present of clothing for what they had done, and one of them, in a striking manner, said she hoped I would excuse her being so forward, but, if she might say it, she felt exceedingly disappointed; she little thought of having clothing given her, but she had hoped I would give her a Bible, that she might read the Scriptures. This had been one of the worst girls, and she had behaved so very badly upon her trial that it was almost shameful. She conducted herself afterwards in so amiable a manner, that her conduct was almost without a flaw. She is now in the Penitentiary, and, I hope, will become a valuable member of society.”
”You have stated three things which to your mind are essential to the reformation of a prison: first, religious instruction; secondly, cla.s.sification; thirdly, employment. Do you think that any reformation can be accomplished without employment?”
”I should believe it impossible; we may instruct as we will, but if we allow them their time, and they have nothing to do, they must naturally return to their evil practices.”
”How many removals of female prisoners have you had in the last year, in Newgate; how many gone to Botany Bay?”
”Eighteen women; and thirty-seven to the Penitentiary.”
”Can you state out of what number of convicts these have been in the course of a year?”
”I do not think I can; but, of course, out of many hundreds.”
”In fact, has there been only one regular removal within the last year?”
”But one. There is one very important thing which ought to be stated on the subject of women taking care of women. It has been said that there were three things which were requisite in forming a prison that would really tend to the reformation of the women; but there is a fourth, viz: that women should be taken care of entirely by women, and have no male attendants, unless it be a medical man or any minister of religion. For I am convinced that much harm arises from the communication, not only to the women themselves, but to those who have the care of them.”
”In the present arrangement is it not so with regard to the women?”
”It is very nearly so; but if I had a prison completely such as I should like it, it would be a prison quite apart from the men's prison, and into which neither turnkeys nor anyone else should enter but female attendants and the Inspecting Committee of Ladies, except, indeed, such gentlemen as come to look after their welfare.”
”In what does the turnkey interfere now with the prison?”